<VV> STP

[Bill Talutis]

For what it's worth:  Years ago we operated international TD-18 crawler 
tractors for ag use.  Each year we had to rebuild the final drives because 
the heat (it gets hot there) would trash the bearings.  One year we added 
several gallons to the final drives just to see if it would help.  We didn't 
need to mess with those final drives after that.  The stuff must have some 
value for improving the heat transfer capability of the oil - or - it just 
makes the oil remain at an acceptable viscosity under hot conditions.  For 
what it's worth.
Bill Talutis
66 140 HP convertable

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <virtualvairs-request at corvair.org>
To: <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 6:22 PM
Subject: VirtualVairs Digest, Vol 84, Issue 12


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> Today's Topics:
>
>   1. Carl Sagan Spyder ~ the patienc of Job (sic) (Charles Lee)
>   2. Barn Find (Ken Pepke)
>   3. Re: Best Oil & STP (J R Read)
>   4. Re: Best Oil & STP (Ron)
>   5. Re: Best Oil & STP (J R Read)
>   6. Re: Best Oil & STP (Vairtec Corporation)
>   7. STP Trick WAS Best Oil & STP (Ken Pepke)
>   8. hot motor oil (Ken Clark)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2012 13:44:17 -0800
> From: "Charles Lee" <chaz at properproper.com>
> Subject: <VV> Carl Sagan Spyder ~ the patienc of Job (sic)
> To: "'Rick Norris'" <ricknorris at suddenlink.net>
> Cc: virtualvairs at corvair.org
> Message-ID: <004801cccb2a$02eccc80$08c66580$@com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Did anyone else notice the dropped 'e' on both ?  (You are a subtle one,
> TLH!)
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: virtualvairs-bounces at corvair.org
> [mailto:virtualvairs-bounces at corvair.org] On Behalf Of Rick Norris
> Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 10:07 AM
> To: Jay Pitchford; Virtual Vairs
> Subject: Re: <VV> Carl Sagan Spyder progress.
>
>
> Yeh, either one of them guys!
> TLH
>
>> ... or the patienc of Job?
>>
>> TLH(jr)
>>
>> On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 8:27 AM, Rick Norris
>> <ricknorris at suddenlink.net>wrote:
>>
>> Dennis is a true craftsman with the patience of Jobe!
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2012 17:06:57 -0500
> From: Ken Pepke <kenpepke at juno.com>
> Subject: <VV> Barn Find
> To: Vair Views <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
> Message-ID: <C35AFB37-E044-4EB6-8370-741A51F86A05 at juno.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>
> A few months back I wrote about a 'barn find' 65 Monza 2 door, 110hp 4 
> speed that had been standing on jack stands in a garage since 1976.  It 
> was pretty much coated with dirt when I got it so I have been scraping and 
> brushing it off.
>
> The more I work on this car the more I realize it is not really the car 
> for me.  Left in my hands it will get a coat of paint and be pressed into 
> regular summer service plus club meetings, parades and tours.  It is just 
> TOO GOOD of a car for my use.  It deserves a proper restoration by someone 
> desiring a very high point show winner.
>
> The body plate reads:
>
> 05D
> ST 65-10537    LOS11740 BODY
> TR 706-     S-S PAINT
> E 2LP
> 4P
>
>
>
> It has NOT been undercoated.  Most of the factory original semi gloss 
> black it still on the underside of the floor pan.  I have seen no sign of 
> rust bulging in any of the pinch welds or in any of the hems except rear 
> deck lid.
>
> The odometer reads 19,000+ miles but the car came with an extra instrument 
> cluster, speedometer missing, and condition of the pedals would indicate 
> many more miles.  I cleaned the oil pan and replaced the filter then 
> started the engine.  It ran for a short period of time and sounded pretty 
> good but I have not driven it at all.
>
> Log on to www.detroitcorvairs. com and click on members project cars then 
> on KenPepke's barn find.  I am asking $2,800.00 and would accept a daily 
> driver or parade condition LM convertible, needing work, in trade.
>
>
>
> Ken P
> Wyandotte, MI
> Worry looks around; Sorry looks back, Faith looks up.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2012 17:24:24 -0600
> From: "J R Read" <hmlinc at sbcglobal.net>
> Subject: Re: <VV> Best Oil & STP
> To: <BobHelt at aol.com>, <jay.pitchford at gmail.com>,
> <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
> Cc: Mlevair at sbcglobal.net
> Message-ID: <C7FD2F9BBB004D90881FBFE4480968C8 at OFFICEDELL>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> Odd that the oil topic came up just after a little "experiment" at work.
>
> A few days ago, one of the guys had Regular oil 5W30, Mobil1 5W30, A 
> bottle
> of STP and a flat edge (relatively heavy) screwdriver.   He dipped the 
> blade
> of the screwdriver into each and had several of us (taking turns and
> cleaning hands and screwdriver each time) holding the screwdriver tip
> between thumb and forefinger with palm above and handle of screwdriver
> hanging down.  Easy to do with nothing on the blade AND with oil on it AND
> with Mobil1 on it.  But, even though it was more viscous to the touch, it
> was virtually impossible to keep the screwdriver from falling when it was
> dipped into the STP.
>
> Now, this makes me think that it might be a good idea to add some (how
> much???) STP at oil change time.  I looked at their web site and could not
> find any specifications for STP.  I was looking to see if there was a
> statement about ZDDP content, but was unable to find anything.
>
> Does anyone on VV have a clue as to ZDDP content of STP and what would be 
> an
> appropriate ratio of oil (either type) to ZDDP if adding at oil change 
> time.
> I'm not condoning this, just trying to investigate at this point.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Later, JR
> CCE CORSA CORVANANTICS SCG member
> '61 Rampside Standard 4/110
> '65 Monza Convertible 4/140
> "Keep the Love Alive"
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: <BobHelt at aol.com>
> To: <jay.pitchford at gmail.com>; <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
> Cc: <Mlevair at sbcglobal.net>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 1:58 PM
> Subject: Re: <VV> Best oil for Corvairs
>
>
>> I've heard that Brad Penn is not rated by the API. Is that correct? If 
>> so,
>> is that good?
>>
>> Regards,
>> Bob Helt
>>
>>
>> In a message dated 1/4/2012 11:09:12 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time,
>> jay.pitchford at gmail.com writes:
>>
>> Brad  Penn oil has plenty of ZDDP in it for sliding friction
>>> surfaces like  camshaft to lifter and fuel pump rod to  eccentric.
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2012 15:32:13 -0800
> From: "Ron" <ronh at owt.com>
> Subject: Re: <VV> Best Oil & STP
> To: "J R Read" <hmlinc at sbcglobal.net>, <BobHelt at aol.com>,
> <jay.pitchford at gmail.com>, <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
> Cc: Mlevair at sbcglobal.net
> Message-ID: <A48A2EFF1B494D9E9FC98446E86FF3B5 at YOUR76500D519C>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> I find it difficult to correlate your test to an operating engine, but 
> I'll
> try.
> RonH
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "J R Read" <hmlinc at sbcglobal.net>
> To: <BobHelt at aol.com>; <jay.pitchford at gmail.com>; 
> <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
> Cc: <Mlevair at sbcglobal.net>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 3:24 PM
> Subject: Re: <VV> Best Oil & STP
>
>
>> Odd that the oil topic came up just after a little "experiment" at work.
>>
>> A few days ago, one of the guys had Regular oil 5W30, Mobil1 5W30, A
>> bottle
>> of STP and a flat edge (relatively heavy) screwdriver.   He dipped the
>> blade
>> of the screwdriver into each and had several of us (taking turns and
>> cleaning hands and screwdriver each time) holding the screwdriver tip
>> between thumb and forefinger with palm above and handle of screwdriver
>> hanging down.  Easy to do with nothing on the blade AND with oil on it 
>> AND
>> with Mobil1 on it.  But, even though it was more viscous to the touch, it
>> was virtually impossible to keep the screwdriver from falling when it was
>> dipped into the STP.
>>
>> Now, this makes me think that it might be a good idea to add some (how
>> much???) STP at oil change time.  I looked at their web site and could 
>> not
>> find any specifications for STP.  I was looking to see if there was a
>> statement about ZDDP content, but was unable to find anything.
>>
>> Does anyone on VV have a clue as to ZDDP content of STP and what would be
>> an
>> appropriate ratio of oil (either type) to ZDDP if adding at oil change
>> time.
>> I'm not condoning this, just trying to investigate at this point.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Later, JR
>> CCE CORSA CORVANANTICS SCG member
>> '61 Rampside Standard 4/110
>> '65 Monza Convertible 4/140
>> "Keep the Love Alive"
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: <BobHelt at aol.com>
>> To: <jay.pitchford at gmail.com>; <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
>> Cc: <Mlevair at sbcglobal.net>
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 1:58 PM
>> Subject: Re: <VV> Best oil for Corvairs
>>
>>
>>> I've heard that Brad Penn is not rated by the API. Is that correct? If
>>> so,
>>> is that good?
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Bob Helt
>>>
>>>
>>> In a message dated 1/4/2012 11:09:12 A.M. US Mountain Standard Time,
>>> jay.pitchford at gmail.com writes:
>>>
>>> Brad  Penn oil has plenty of ZDDP in it for sliding friction
>>>> surfaces like  camshaft to lifter and fuel pump rod to  eccentric.
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> This message was sent by the VirtualVairs mailing list, all copyrights 
>> are
>> the property
>> of the writer, please attribute properly. For help,
>> mailto:vv-help at corvair.org
>> This list sponsored by the Corvair Society of America,
>> http://www.corvair.org/
>> Post messages to: VirtualVairs at corvair.org
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>> _______________________________________________
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2012 17:37:56 -0600
> From: "J R Read" <hmlinc at sbcglobal.net>
> Subject: Re: <VV> Best Oil & STP
> To: "Ron" <ronh at owt.com>, <BobHelt at aol.com>,
> <jay.pitchford at gmail.com>, <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
> Cc: Mlevair at sbcglobal.net
> Message-ID: <5BCDD9E7591F4C85B7544376D6624FB8 at OFFICEDELL>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=response
>
> Me too!  Only that it makes me wonder if it is a "parlor trick" or if 
> there
> is a real reason to consider using STP in the oil.
>
> Later, JR
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Ron" <ronh at owt.com>
> To: "J R Read" <hmlinc at sbcglobal.net>; <BobHelt at aol.com>;
> <jay.pitchford at gmail.com>; <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
> Cc: <Mlevair at sbcglobal.net>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 5:32 PM
> Subject: Re: <VV> Best Oil & STP
>
>
>>I find it difficult to correlate your test to an operating engine, but 
>>I'll
>>try.
>> RonH
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "J R Read" <hmlinc at sbcglobal.net>
>> To: <BobHelt at aol.com>; <jay.pitchford at gmail.com>;
>> <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
>> Cc: <Mlevair at sbcglobal.net>
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 04, 2012 3:24 PM
>> Subject: Re: <VV> Best Oil & STP
>>
>>
>>> Odd that the oil topic came up just after a little "experiment" at work.
>>>
>>> A few days ago, one of the guys had Regular oil 5W30, Mobil1 5W30, A
>>> bottle
>>> of STP and a flat edge (relatively heavy) screwdriver.   He dipped the
>>> blade
>>> of the screwdriver into each and had several of us (taking turns and
>>> cleaning hands and screwdriver each time) holding the screwdriver tip
>>> between thumb and forefinger with palm above and handle of screwdriver
>>> hanging down.  Easy to do with nothing on the blade AND with oil on it
>>> AND
>>> with Mobil1 on it.  But, even though it was more viscous to the touch, 
>>> it
>>> was virtually impossible to keep the screwdriver from falling when it 
>>> was
>>> dipped into the STP.
>>>
>>> Now, this makes me think that it might be a good idea to add some (how
>>> much???) STP at oil change time.  I looked at their web site and could
>>> not
>>> find any specifications for STP.  I was looking to see if there was a
>>> statement about ZDDP content, but was unable to find anything.
>>>
>>> Does anyone on VV have a clue as to ZDDP content of STP and what would 
>>> be
>>> an
>>> appropriate ratio of oil (either type) to ZDDP if adding at oil change
>>> time.
>>> I'm not condoning this, just trying to investigate at this point.
>>>
>>> Thanks.
>>>
>>> Later, JR
>>> CCE CORSA CORVANANTICS SCG member
>>> '61 Rampside Standard 4/110
>>> '65 Monza Convertible 4/140
>>> "Keep the Love Alive"
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 04 Jan 2012 18:58:28 -0500
> From: Vairtec Corporation <Vairtec at optonline.net>
> Subject: Re: <VV> Best Oil & STP
> To: virtualvairs at corvair.org
> Message-ID: <4F04E7A4.4080706 at optonline.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Apparently, someone where you work remembers the old STP television
> commercial -- from the Andy Granatelli days -- wherein the "superiority"
> of STP was demonstrated by this very trick, trying to hold an STP-dipped
> screwdriver by the blade.
>
> What does it mean?  Beats me.  But because of my involvement in
> oval-track racing I got free cases of STP quite frequently -- it was a
> series sponsor -- and I began using it in my Greenbrier circa 1967.
> That same Greenbrier still runs fine today with never an engine-related
> problem.  (Transmission problems, sure.  Diff problems, check.  But
> engine problems, no.)
>
> I stopped using STP in the Greenbrier when I began to use Mobil One.  No
> reason, I just did.  Switched more recently to Brad Penn.
>
> --Bob
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2012 19:10:05 -0500
> From: Ken Pepke <kenpepke at juno.com>
> Subject: <VV> STP Trick WAS Best Oil & STP
> To: Vair Views <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
> Message-ID: <5595AFED-B0C0-4E6C-BE15-087DA5C412F9 at juno.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>
> STP Corporation sales people have been using the screwdriver trick for a 
> lot of years.  I was about 12 when I first saw it ... that would be 57 
> years ago and it was not new then.  Its ingredients were their secret then 
> and they still are. I have been assembling street and race engines using 
> STP as assembly lube since I was a teen ager.  Now, I am not so sure ZDDP 
> is all that important on a Corvair engine.  There is just not all that 
> much seat pressure with which to deal compared to the spring seat pressure 
> on an big valve 8,000 RPM race engine.
>
> Interesting thing is the STP is still present when the engine is 
> disassembled ... even after quite a lot of mileage.  You can feel it! 
> And, on the dyno, STP engines will pull more power when compared to using 
> factory assembly lube.
>
> It does take a bit of effort to ad it to an assembled engine.  If ya just 
> dump the stuff in it will settle in the bottom of the pan.  Ya have to be 
> running the engine pretty hard meter the STP in gradually.
>
>
>
>> From: "J R Read" <hmlinc at sbcglobal.net>
>> Date: January 4, 2012 6:24:24 PM EST
>> To: <BobHelt at aol.com>, <jay.pitchford at gmail.com>, 
>> <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
>> Cc: Mlevair at sbcglobal.net
>> Subject: Re: <VV> Best Oil & STP
>>
>> Odd that the oil topic came up just after a little "experiment" at work.
>>
>> A few days ago, one of the guys had Regular oil 5W30, Mobil1 5W30, A 
>> bottle
>> of STP and a flat edge (relatively heavy) screwdriver.   He dipped the 
>> blade
>> of the screwdriver into each and had several of us (taking turns and
>> cleaning hands and screwdriver each time) holding the screwdriver tip
>> between thumb and forefinger with palm above and handle of screwdriver
>> hanging down.  Easy to do with nothing on the blade AND with oil on it 
>> AND
>> with Mobil1 on it.  But, even though it was more viscous to the touch, it
>> was virtually impossible to keep the screwdriver from falling when it was
>> dipped into the STP.
>>
>> Now, this makes me think that it might be a good idea to add some (how
>> much???) STP at oil change time.  I looked at their web site and could 
>> not
>> find any specifications for STP.  I was looking to see if there was a
>> statement about ZDDP content, but was unable to find anything.
>>
>> Does anyone on VV have a clue as to ZDDP content of STP and what would be 
>> an
>> appropriate ratio of oil (either type) to ZDDP if adding at oil change 
>> time.
>> I'm not condoning this, just trying to investigate at this point.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Later, JR
>> CCE CORSA CORVANANTICS SCG member
>> '61 Rampside Standard 4/110
>> '65 Monza Convertible 4/140
>> "Keep the Love Alive"
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2012 19:22:19 -0500
> From: Ken Clark <kcvair at hotmail.com>
> Subject: <VV> hot motor oil
> To: <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
> Message-ID: <SNT123-W43D763B516A85037E70295CB940 at phx.gbl>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
>
> Since the motor oil topic came up again I have a question concerning oil 
> when it gets hot(engine running temp Corvair).  A few years back I made a 
> 1000 mi. round trip to Helen Ga show.  The engine did not use excessive 
> oil, maybe a qt. in 400 mi.  I was told Mobil 1 was the way to go, so 
> changed to MObil 1 before the trip.  Used about 8 qts round trip.  A 
> Mobil(expert) tells me that the oil is thin as water and runs right 
> through the engine.  My thought is that any oil is thin at engine temp. 
> Changed back to 10W40 Quaker ST. and did not have usage problem.  Any 
> thoughts on this situation?
> By the way, everyone(almost) used STP back in the 60's and did you ever 
> take an engine apart that had been using it?  I've taken pans off that 
> were covered with 1/2 inch of sludge.  I 'm told that was from STP and 
> other additives.  Not sure, but know what I've seen.
> Ken C
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> This message was sent by the VirtualVairs mailing list, all copyrights are 
> the property
> of the writer, please attribute properly. For help, mail to: 
> vv-help at corvair.org
> This list sponsored by the Corvair Society of America, 
> http://www.corvair.org/
> VirtualVairs at corvair.org
> http://www.vv.corvair.org/mailman/listinfo/virtualvairs
> Change your options: 
> http://www.vv.corvair.org/mailman/options/virtualvairs
>
> End of VirtualVairs Digest, Vol 84, Issue 12
> ********************************************