<VV> Propane

[Tom Berg]

Liquified petroleum gas -- "propane " -- has been a byproduct of oil refining, 
but now about 55% of propane comes from natural gas, according to the Propane 
Education & Research Council (www.propanecouncil.org). It also says that propane 
is the most widely used alternative fuel in the world, with 14 million vehicles 
burning it, though not many in the U.S. Yet the infrastructure is in place here 
for us to use if we want to. 


--Tom in Ohio

--Tom Berg




________________________________
From: "jvhroberts at aol.com" <jvhroberts at aol.com>
To: vairguy at echoes.net; virtualvairs at corvair.org
Sent: Thu, March 10, 2011 4:15:08 PM
Subject: Re: <VV> [VV-talk] RAISE GAS PRICES TO $5.00 A GALLON?

The idea of CNG implementation is to go for the low hanging fruit 
first. Cars are less practical due to range and the size of the tanks. 
Propane makes more sense than CNG, but alas, it has the same problems 
and propane comes from oil.

Using CNG in trucks and buses makes FAR more sense, as these use lots 
of fuel and have the room for the tankage. So, that's where you start.

Using nuclear, wind, solar, et al, to displace CNG has another benefit. 
NG is the second largest raw material stream for refineries. It's the 
source of hydrogen to make refined products, virtually all of which 
have far more hydrogen than the crude stream feeding it. So, knocking 
down the cost of NG helps the economics of running a refinery.

John Roberts

-----Original Message-----
From: Ray Rodriguez III <vairguy at echoes.net>
To: jvhroberts at aol.com; Virtual Vairs <virtualvairs at corvair.org>
Sent: Thu, Mar 10, 2011 11:20 am
Subject: Re: [VV-talk] RAISE GAS PRICES TO $5.00 A GALLON?


I did have a little mental lapse there on the power generation.  Most 
of our power is generated by coal, but not much oil so it wouldn't 
effect transportation fuel cost or demand, but all the other benefits 
are valid. Also interestingly the #2 fuel for US electricity generation 
is Natural Gas, so if we went to (near) 100% nuclear power the demand 
and price of natural gas would likely drop and help make CNG even more 
practical for automotive use. 
 
As for the CNG, my father visited family in Buenos Aires, Argentina 
about 5 years ago.  He said it seemed like just about all the cars were 
running CNG, though using gasoline for the initial start. 
 
Ray R. 
 
 
----- Original Message ----- From: <jvhroberts at aol.com> 
To: <vairguy at echoes.net>; <VV-talk at corvair.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2011 4:51 PM 
Subject: Re: [VV-talk] RAISE GAS PRICES TO $5.00 A GALLON? 
 
First of all, Ray, we don't use oil to make electricity, and 
electricity really doesn't power our transportation. So, one has little 
to do with the other. 
 
Now, using CNG for commercial transportation makes a lot of sense 
because they have the room for the tanks, and commercial transportation 
is the high consumption part of our transportation, to the tune of 35% 
or more of our motor fuel goes to commercial transportation. BAsically, 
the Pickens Plan. Alas, NG has nearly no lobby in DC... 
 
John Roberts 
 

  
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